SPEAKER_03 0:11

This is NBJ, a weekend class held on February one and two in Las Vegas. This is take one and one. Clifton Davis opens this class by giving a case study of one of our players who is using an interesting spot play method in Atlantic City. And as you will hear, this individual has never lost with an asterisk, and you'll hear the story. Let us proceed.

SPEAKER_05 0:55

Call me uh the night before last, just before I left to come here. His name is Jan Tayer Mino. Most of you have heard Jan and uh tapes before. And I want to talk to you a little bit about Jan. Because I think that Jan represents the type of story that's very easy for any one of you to achieve if you have the desire to do so. John's a very young guy. He was a dental student. He just graduated dental school. And he was one of the early buyers of NBJ. And a year ago, or just shy of a year ago, John called me and he said, Look, Alice, he says, I want to play NBJ. And he says, My problem is he I have a very small bank role, and it's all the money that I have in the world. And I said, Well, how much is it? And he said, $50. I says, geez, John, you know, this is going to be a little tough. And he says, Well, how he says, I live near Atlantic City. He says, How can I start with $50 and end up being a blackjack player? So we mapped out a program for Jan's first-based program, and John still strictly plays the first base system because there's less risk in the first base system. And anyone that has a small bankroll might consider that the first base system is a low-risk system. Jan went to the casino with his $50 and went through the program that I told him. Well, I got several other phone calls from Jan, and Jan was very successful on his first five or six trips. In fact, he was extremely successful from a win-loss ratio. He just simply never lost. Until one day he called me up and he was virtually in tears. And I said, John, what's the matter? And he said, I lost. And I said, Oh. I said, well, give me the bottom line, John. And he's and he's virtually crying. And I said, what happened? You know, how much did you lose? And he said, a half a shoe. And I said, you lost a half a shoe and you're calling me? And he said, yeah. And I said, well, what did you lose in units, John? He said, I lost two units. He says, what should I do? I says, how about suicide? And that was John's. It would have been a losing day. Well, it wasn't. I says, John, where were you playing? And uh he said, the Sands. And I said, uh what were you playing? He says, third base. I says, uh-huh. I said, I told you not to play third base, didn't I? You know, you don't have the money for third base. And he says, what should I do? And I says, I you should play first base at the Sands. The Sands is a very good first base casino. So he said, okay, and he hung up. Well, what he did, he thought I meant right then, so he got in his car and he went back the same day. And he called me up later that night, and he was all happy again. He won, he won playing first base. But this is uh John Taermino. To to my knowledge, that $50 losing trip is the only losing trip that he had. Now, these 10 um these these 10 wins, these 10 trip wins, they were uh back in the in the uh the fall. And uh now John plays a lot more than he played then. He's out of dental school now, he's paid his uh tuition's off and so forth. And John just called me the night before last with his latest uh episode, and I thought you might like to to hear it. Oh, how the hell are you?

SPEAKER_00 4:57

I'm doing phenomenal.

SPEAKER_05 5:00

He you said you won ten you you've won your last ten in a row. Well you had a string of them going before that too.

SPEAKER_00 5:06

Okay, now this is uh I'm talking about ten times in a little over two weeks. I've been going almost every day. All right. During this time I my I've averaged between two hundred and fifty and uh my highest win uh was five fifty.

SPEAKER_05 5:21

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

He's a short session. Three and a half hour session.

SPEAKER_05 5:24

You're playing first base.

SPEAKER_00 5:26

Playing first base.

SPEAKER_05 5:27

And what what chips are you playing?

SPEAKER_00 5:29

Uh green.

SPEAKER_05 5:30

Green chips, one five?

SPEAKER_00 5:32

No, no rent.

SPEAKER_05 5:34

No rent, okay.

SPEAKER_00 5:35

Okay, this is the realization I've made now. Now what I'd like you to do, maybe think about it, and I know you have access to computers and people who are into this type of uh statistical data, figuring out the advantage and long-term winning percentages. What they have done now, uh I don't know if I'm right in my thinking, but it's working.

SPEAKER_05 5:58

They have the the s the conditions down in Atlantic City right now are the most brutal that I've ever seen.

SPEAKER_00 6:03

I absolutely agree. They are they're crazy. I think they want to win a h they don't want to win.

SPEAKER_05 6:08

Every game. Every game. They want to win every hand. That's the way it is. They're filling up every table and keeping all the rest completely empty. That's right, they so you play seven players or you don't play at all.

SPEAKER_00 6:20

That's exactly right. And if there's no table selection for third base, really. There's none.

SPEAKER_05 6:25

Right. What casinos have you been playing?

SPEAKER_00 6:27

Uh Sands, Bally's, um, Taj and Caesars. So you're playing into Caesars lately. They've been pretty decent.

SPEAKER_05 6:37

So you've been playing most of the strip?

SPEAKER_00 6:39

Yes. I have to play most of the strip. Now I'll tell you the w my thinking on this new method. Uh you know how they've clo been clo m they're not keeping many cables open.

SPEAKER_04 6:50

Right.

SPEAKER_00 6:51

Uh now since they're they're just keeping uh the same cables and open all day and they're never they're not even changing the cards now. They're keeping the same cards uh for twenty-four hours.

SPEAKER_05 7:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 7:04

So keeping the same cards for twenty four hours. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:07

I don't know if I'm right in this thinking. The ev almost I think every single game down there, nine nine out of ten are severely clumped now.

SPEAKER_04 7:15

Right.

SPEAKER_00 7:16

Clumped enough so first base will work.

SPEAKER_05 7:18

Right.

SPEAKER_00 7:19

At almost every table.

SPEAKER_05 7:20

Right. Now what I've been doing Are you playing all eight deck games?

SPEAKER_00 7:23

All eight uh oh, I had my biggest win at uh Taj at the Trump Plaza, six deck.

SPEAKER_05 7:29

And six deck at the Trump Plaza.

SPEAKER_00 7:31

Yes, I hardly lost a hand.

SPEAKER_05 7:34

God.

SPEAKER_00 7:35

Okay, it's it's I I don't know why.

SPEAKER_05 7:38

I had one like that in the sands uh last month. I hardly lost a hand.

SPEAKER_00 7:44

Uh to the Trump Plaza and I lost maybe four hands.

SPEAKER_04 7:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:48

What I'm doing, uh that's my philosophy. These games are it's working at almost every table. Now this is the key to this system. You go in there, say you go in there with a with a unit back of a quarter.

SPEAKER_04 7:59

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 8:00

Now what do I what do I do now? And if you the table foot conditions are crazy.

SPEAKER_04 8:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:05

You sit down and qualify tables, you'll get into three tables for the night.

SPEAKER_04 8:09

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 8:10

What I've been doing and I've and it is holding up, I'm just going into a table that has a first base seat.

SPEAKER_04 8:17

Period.

SPEAKER_00 8:17

Period. Um if I see a final ten in a neutral or high ratio round, I need to make the high bet.

SPEAKER_04 8:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:24

Okay?

SPEAKER_04 8:25

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 8:26

Uh if I win it, I stay there and do I won't bet any filler rounds. I'll get up, I'll go in my pockets, I'll call the pit balls over, give them my card, my comp card.

SPEAKER_05 8:35

So the time. So the only time you're betting is high round. High round yeah, I knew that. High round final ten.

SPEAKER_00 8:43

Final ten, but now no qualifying because I found that qualifying. No qualifying and no you don't have to qualify anyway because uh these games are highly clumped and Is this any time during the day? Excuse me?

SPEAKER_05 8:56

What time of the day are you playing? Nights. Nights, okay. What time at nights?

SPEAKER_00 9:01

Uh after five.

SPEAKER_05 9:02

After five, okay. Okay, now uh what are you Are you playing weekends and weekdays or just weekdays?

SPEAKER_00 9:07

Uh weekdays, no Satur Friday, Saturday. Okay. Never. You can't get a first date. I forg I gave up one night. So what do I I go in there, I never make a rent bet. I'm betting high bets only when I'm seeing a final ten and at least a string of high cards to end it with no loan ten bets.

SPEAKER_05 9:24

And they're letting you do that?

SPEAKER_00 9:26

They're letting me do it. Um I found that you really don't have to qualify most of these tables. In the long run, now this is what I want to ask you. The math is uh uh it should work at half the tables.

unknown 9:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 9:43

I'd have to figure that out. Yeah, John, but it uh the last time you kept track, you were wanting nine out of fourteen.

SPEAKER_00 9:52

Right. But what I was what I'm what I'm alluding to is even even though you're not qualifying, mm-hmm uh if you go into twenty different tables though, you understand instead of qualifying going into high, the tables that it don't work, you're still only betting the high bets.

SPEAKER_05 10:08

Right. And so you're gonna you What percentage of the tables are you finding you win that way?

SPEAKER_00 10:12

Almost every table.

SPEAKER_05 10:13

Yeah. It's they're clumped out, that's what the difference is, yeah. They've got their s they've got their normal midsummer clumping going on in midwinter. Oh geez. Hang on just a second. John, hang on just a second. Hello.

SPEAKER_01 10:28

Hello, is this uh Alice?

SPEAKER_05 10:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:31

Hi, uh my name's Harry Grunstein.

SPEAKER_05 10:34

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 10:35

And uh I purchased your Red B J a couple of weeks ago.

SPEAKER_05 10:40

Harry, I'm I'm right in the middle of another call. Where are you calling from? Uh the Bronx. The Bronx, jeez, I'm I'm talking to the Bronx. Uh-huh. Uh well, could you call me back on Tuesday? Because I'm I'm just leaving for Atlantic City or for uh Vegas. On Tuesday, sure. Yeah. This is no emergency. Okay. Yeah, give me a call back on uh on Tuesday because I have a seminar down in uh Vegas and I'm just getting ready to go.

unknown 11:08

Good.

SPEAKER_01 11:09

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 11:10

Okay, thanks, Harry. Bye-bye.

unknown 11:12

Bye-bye.

SPEAKER_05 11:13

Sorry about that. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 11:14

Now what I want to, you know, maybe have you do some research on because this might be the way to be Atlantic City at what they're doing to us now. Uh-huh. You're only betting uh high rounds only, and making a rent bet. You're running from table to table in the casino. You can play quarter table, you can jump in in a ten dollar table, it opens up the whole casino. So at any time in the casino, I have I I have tables open, so I am getting off many bets an hour.

SPEAKER_05 11:42

Now wait a minute. How? I mean you can only sit down if the first base is open.

SPEAKER_00 11:47

There's first base open, you know, maybe full five tables uh constantly, if it is twenty tables open in the casino. Okay. Okay, now what I do is um I'm only betting first base, I'm only betting uh the high rounds, and I'm moving. It's oh but what I'm I'm coining is mobile first base.

SPEAKER_05 12:06

But why are you moving?

SPEAKER_00 12:07

Okay. I if if i if I'm winning, I'm staying in.

SPEAKER_05 12:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 12:11

Okay. All right. Now this is what I do.

SPEAKER_05 12:13

What percentage of the games are you feigning that you're winning at?

SPEAKER_00 12:16

Roughly. Okay. I have a two chip if I lose the first two I I go to another table immediately.

SPEAKER_05 12:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:21

Immediately.

SPEAKER_05 12:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:23

Um I'm finding that I'm winning in seventy percent of the games.

SPEAKER_05 12:27

Seventy percent?

SPEAKER_00 12:28

Yes.

SPEAKER_05 12:29

All right, Jan, that's good. That's real good.

SPEAKER_00 12:31

Now, uh what I want to ask you is I think uh even though you're not qualifying, you're getting off more bets per hour, and they're only the very high percentage bet.

SPEAKER_05 12:41

Right. Now you You actually, Jan, when you stop and think about it, you're playing right now you're playing virtually exactly according to the manual, except that you're not playing you're not paying rent.

SPEAKER_00 12:52

I'm up and also I'm running from table ta I am going into table very quickly.

SPEAKER_05 12:58

Yeah. Well you're supposed to do that in the first base system. It either works or it doesn't work. So two losses in a row, first two losses, you'd get out anyways.

SPEAKER_00 13:05

Right. Now uh when I'm playing at a table, uh if I don't if I'm like winning one or two units and I see it's not it's a back and forth, mm-hmm, I I go to another table.

SPEAKER_05 13:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:15

I'm staying I like to stay at tables where I'm winning seventy-five percent now, otherwise I lose.

SPEAKER_05 13:20

Yeah, so you're looking for a real good win to sit to stay.

SPEAKER_00 13:22

Yep, and the thing is I'm scalping one or two units a t off each table. I'm playing six, seven tables an hour.

SPEAKER_04 13:28

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:30

I'm destru I'm devastating them.

SPEAKER_04 13:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:33

Now this might be the highest percentage of them all, this type of mobile first base, meaning r running from table to table.

SPEAKER_04 13:40

Sure, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:41

You know, just moving from table to table, uh and you know, just setting on the high round.

SPEAKER_05 13:47

Yeah. I I play first base that way. You know, I only stay if I'm doing doing very well. I don't stay I don't stay in uh break even games and I don't stay on losing games. Uh and that's what I'm finding too, that the majority of the games you can win that way.

SPEAKER_00 14:05

And the the whole key, I think, is the mobility factor.

SPEAKER_05 14:08

You're gonna stand But why do you think that, Jan? I mean I mean, why is it different from the manual? That's what I'm asking, I guess.

SPEAKER_00 14:14

Because you're getting into more games if you sit there and qualify.

SPEAKER_05 14:18

Oh, oh, elimination of the qualification. Okay. I'm with you. I'm with you now. All right.

SPEAKER_00 14:22

Okay, because I'll I'll get it. Just don't even worry about qualifications, just go with the high bets or say in the long run, I'm thinking since it works at half the games anyway, yeah. You're better off get increasing your bets per hour at a smaller percentage of the at a larger percent of the table, reducing your advantage but getting more bets per hour than uh not you know, been making only f eight bets in an hour. In the games bets in an hour, ten percent when you can make seventy-five at six percent.

SPEAKER_04 14:50

Yeah. Right.

SPEAKER_00 14:51

Bottom line is gonna be a lot more uh that way.

SPEAKER_05 14:55

Sure, sure. I'm for that. You know, I'm for playing rather than w searching.

SPEAKER_00 14:59

And that uh and again China, are you raising your stakes when you're winning? Yes, if it's a it's a if it's an explosive table. Now I'm not finding too many explosive tables. Yeah. Finding tables where I'm able to stop three, four units and split. Yeah. Go to another table in the same casino, usually right next door, the table I'm playing in.

SPEAKER_04 15:16

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 15:17

And uh I'll never lose more than two units in a table.

SPEAKER_04 15:20

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 15:20

And most of the time you uh if you lose there'll be one unit and you'll split. Yeah. 'Cause it's very rare when you do lose two the first two.

SPEAKER_05 15:30

But you're saying you win two units and split.

SPEAKER_00 15:32

Why would you not win two units, I'm saying it's very rare when you lose the first two units actually.

SPEAKER_05 15:37

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:37

It is. With NBJ.

SPEAKER_05 15:40

But you're saying you're picking up two or three units per table, but why are you leaving those?

SPEAKER_00 15:45

If I'm in the hand I played maybe eight hands, I've won five and lost three.

SPEAKER_05 15:51

I see, and you leave. I gotcha. All right.

SPEAKER_00 15:59

This way you're in more games, uh, you're constantly playing, but at this very high percentage bat win rate.

SPEAKER_04 16:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:06

But this is the highest uh percentage, mm-hmm. Uh, you know, what what did you what do we say the percentage is at first base? The chances to win off of in the fifteen percent.

SPEAKER_05 16:16

You're fifteen percent player advantage, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:18

Right. Now if you're only playing a fifth you're only playing when that bet is in occurrence, you're not betting the filler rounds, which would reduce that.

SPEAKER_04 16:27

Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_00 16:28

Uh and you're constantly making that bet. Yeah. Like when you're sitting down and playing, you could go and try to shoe and have only two plays.

SPEAKER_04 16:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:37

This way, uh, you're having plays like one every two minutes.

SPEAKER_05 16:42

Actually, you're showing you're showing much higher than fifteen percent player advantage that way. Uh I I don't know. We'd have to f sta we'd have to sit down and figure out what it is, you know, but that it depends.

SPEAKER_00 16:55

But I think the key to the discovery that I've made is uh even if you again qualifying takes a long time, uh sitting down and playing first base is uh you can't make that much. You can make nice hits, but many times in Atlantic City and everywhere, there might be one or two plays a shoe.

SPEAKER_04 17:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:15

This way, if you're you know, if you're an active person, you're not afraid to walk a little fast, you see an old first base shot, you maybe sit in, you're almost you're playing that high percentage bet so much frequently, you could be making thirty bets an hour. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 17:31

Yeah. Yeah, you know, another thing too is when you get when you get through with the uh you know, like if the table next to you is open and you get through with the high card clump in one table You run to the next table you might as well go to the next table, that's right, to get more bets in, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:46

I figured even if I'm gonna uh playing at a uh you know, this way I'm not qualifying the table, but it's gonna work at half the table anyway. I'm not betting any rent. And uh it's you're gonna get w quadruple the bets off per hour this way.

SPEAKER_04 18:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:02

So this could be a way where I mean we just bankrupt them.

SPEAKER_04 18:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:07

I mean it. I th I this is I I've never seen anything like this. I've ever played it this way either.

SPEAKER_05 18:13

Very, very interesting.

SPEAKER_00 18:15

The most interesting thing I've seen, Alice. I mean it, I'm very excited. Because I'm re I'm I'm I'm really thinking to go a hundred dollars now.

SPEAKER_04 18:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:22

Because I think I can win a thousand dollars a day with no effort at all. Yeah. Ten units is easy.

SPEAKER_04 18:27

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 18:28

And you know, I can't believe I'm saying this. With all my you know, education that I can't believe how easy it is with this tragedy to make that kind of money. Ten units.

SPEAKER_04 18:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:38

It's shocking.

SPEAKER_05 18:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:41

I can't belie it it's like they it's like going there and just taking the money away.

SPEAKER_05 18:45

Candy store.

SPEAKER_00 18:45

It w it is a candy store right now. They're wise guys because they you know, they think they're, you know well they are, they're very bright.

SPEAKER_04 18:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:53

But we are a little brighter, I think, right now. Uh, because we really know what's going on.

SPEAKER_04 18:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:59

And uh with this mobile first base, that's what I call it, it the only there's nothing they can do. I'm making that high percentage bet so frequently that I could I uh could predict ninety percent winning trips there at least.

SPEAKER_05 19:14

Yeah, you know, I tried to get the point across in the newsletter and I don't think I did very well because I still have people asking a lot of questions. But when the conditions are like that, you know, when the cond the worse the conditions are, the better the better the first space system plays, you know.

SPEAKER_00 19:29

Yes. In Atlantic City it works in every every house.

SPEAKER_05 19:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:32

It isn't working against the strip shuffle at valleys.

SPEAKER_04 19:36

Yeah, really.

SPEAKER_00 19:37

It works in any shuffle.

SPEAKER_04 19:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:42

You know, I've I was thinking about it and then I did a little work on my own with the Kelly criterion. You know that I'm sure you've dealt with that before.

SPEAKER_05 19:49

The Kelly criterion.

SPEAKER_00 19:50

Uh how to figure out your vacu uh edge.

SPEAKER_05 19:53

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:54

And then you know, I was you know, playing around with it, figuring if I go into fifty percent of the tables and it's only working there, but my spent increased four times per hour, it'll be a bigger game than qualifying.

SPEAKER_04 20:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:07

So that's this is it's you know, it's it's a very active system. You have to be willing to walk, and again, you can't listen to the players when you jump in and out of rounds.

SPEAKER_04 20:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:19

And it's it's very, very fascinating. And it's very shocking. I love it, I can't believe it how easy it is to take the money away. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 20:28

And it's it's great. All right. That is wonderful.

SPEAKER_00 20:33

So, you know, maybe you can do a little, you know, mathematical research and validation on yeah on this type of playing philosophy.

SPEAKER_05 20:41

I well, I certainly will.

SPEAKER_00 20:42

You know, it's what our percentage would be taking to effect we're not qualifying, but we're getting so many more bets per hour.

SPEAKER_05 20:48

Yeah. So there's an awful lot of information uh on that particular tape. For for a lot of you new people, a lot of that tape will be over your head until I explain some of the things. But let's talk first off what what no rent betting means. In the first base system, as you know, the objective is to bet high and bet low. Bet high when you suspect a 10's coming. And the way John is doing it and most of the other first base players are doing it is they'll bet high when it's the prior round is high tens ratio, and there's a final ten in the prior round. And that's all they're looking at, just those two things: high ratio, high tens ratio, and uh and a final ten. Uh but what John is doing, different from that, is he simply does not make the low bet, period. He just sits there and waits for the high tens ratio, final ten, and then he makes his bet. So he's paying no rent, he's paying no losing hands, he's only making the high. bets and on those he's fine he finds that he is winning uh nine out of fourteen of the of the high bets now when we said in the manual when we talked about uh the newsletter and we said system tannamount to stealing that's part of what we're talking about there is the way uh is the way John plays this game with no uh rent bets do they let you do that in all casinos no they don't let you do that in all casinos in fact I was very surprised could because just a year ago they didn't let you do it in Atlantic City in fact they had signs up on the table that said you must play every hand uh why all of a sudden they're letting you do that when they never used to I can't tell you but they're letting you do it all over Atlantic City. Whenever they throw you a bone you should you should take advantage of that bone and that's exactly what John is doing. Now he's nice to the John as you can tell he's a very uh charismatic individual and he can he can get on the side the good side of the pit bosses and the dealers and they let him do that and they let him do it wherever he plays but I find out from the other players now that we have given this system to the same thing that the casinos are letting them do that. Just sit there and and bet whenever they want to whenever they feel like it. Now the casinos they have not been able to figure out what these people are keying on so they're not the least bit concerned about it and it's very hard for the casinos to keep track of somebody that's only betting maybe one out of three hands. It's very hard for them to keep track of whether they're winning or losing and John puts his chips in his in his pocket so the casinos just haven't bothered him at all. John wins every single time he goes to the casino so I think it's something that you should take a look at. I mentioned that there aren't as many first base situations here in Nevada. However Curley Ferris would uh would argue with me vehemently he's not been able to find a losing situation at first base in Nevada. This is why you know I'm a little skeptical when when one individual gets up and says I can't find any games because I have 10 or 15 individuals that do nothing but find games and win them. You know so I I kind of wonder what's wrong with the one individual. I don't worry about what's wrong with the 15 individuals. Okay I just wanted to give you an idea of what you can do with this first base system. I know that in the manual I kind of look at the first base system as a as a secondary system by myself I usually only play it when I'm too tired to play the third base system because the first bass system is so simple you could fall asleep while you're playing I think that's my problem with it I they do have to wake me up when they start each new each new deal but but on the other hand $18,000 was won in 20 minutes right here a couple of weeks ago at the Mirage Harvey won $1,000 playing first base in his first game he won another $15,000 playing first base down in uh down in the islands and uh it's a viable system. I mean just because it's so simple doesn't mean that it's it's not viable it's a very very viable system and for people that are just starting out that's a good way to get your your feet wet because it is a low risk system. If you should lose at it when you're playing one four or one five you're not going to lose a lot of money compared to if you're playing third base one four six and you lose that can that can be disheartening to say the least okay so it's a until you really know what you're doing we mentioned in the manual that it's good to play it first to learn how to play the third base system. Play it first and watch what's happening at third base and you get the feel of third base from a low risk position at at first base. Okay uh one of the questions that came up yesterday a number of times that I really didn't have a chance to get into uh and I I think you brought it up once and it was brought up several other times is what about these games where I get in the game and I continue to win the the first bet the first bet and when I'm playing 146 or 134 I'm losing money people feel because I'm winning the first bet. Let me show you something on the board about that. It's nothing to be concerned about. I said yesterday that when I go in the game, when I play third base, my objective is to win one pile per shoe. That's the rate that I'm looking for. If I'm not winning at that rate but I am winning those are the kinds of games that I'm going to get out at a win. That's I know that I can achieve that rate a one pile per shoe and I'm talking eight deck but it's very close to the same as six deck. So if I'm winning more than that great. If I'm winning that great if I'm winning less than that I know that I'm not in a game that's as good as a game that I can find. I can find a better game if I'm not winning that rate. Okay if you're winning one pile per shoe let's there's an average of about 14 hands per shoe regardless of whether you're playing six deck or eight deck. Now the reason it's it's about 14 reason it's the same regardless of the number of the decks is because you tend to have less players in six deck games in the areas where they have six deck games and you have an eight deck games. Eight deck games are are usually full. Not all the time but it it's it's a rough average but if I were in a situation where I won the first bet all throughout the entire shoe okay I'm gonna win 14 units in that shoe. So I have achieved my goal I'm trying to win 12 units in the shoe. If I do it one unit at a time I have achieved my goal I'm not going to be unhappy about that. Sure it's true that had I used uh up as you win betting that I would have won more in that particular shoe okay but on the other hand if I if I don't win every hand in the shoe up as you win betting is not going to be not going to win me as many chips in the shoe as up as you lose betting. And I'll show you why what I'm trying to do basically is to average one chip per hand. That's what I'm trying to win one chip per hand. Okay? If I play one four six if I win the first bet I'm winning one chip per hand. If I win the second bet I'm winning three chips and two hands. It's a little bit better than one chip per hand. If I win the third bet, I'm winning one chip and three hands. The average of all of that is just slightly over one chip per hand. So if I keep winning the first bet, am I losing money? No. I'm achieving my goal of one chip per hand. So it doesn't matter whether I'm winning the first bet or the second bet. Now if I continuously win the third bet, I'm not going to quite achieve my average of one chip per hand. Okay? So don't get discouraged because you're winning every hand. I mean think about that. Okay let me show you some tricks here that can can really help you.

SPEAKER_01 30:41

Do you use your regular betting unit the whole way through or do you let's say you're at a $5 table and you were playing a quarter unit normally would you sit there play five dollars until you uh get into your uh negative betting progression or would you play the quarters all the time? No you don't drop back to the to the minimum table minimum before you get into your uh progression.

SPEAKER_05 31:11

This chip here may or may not be the table minimum. If it's a quarter question please I'm not sure what it was.

SPEAKER_01 31:22

Do when you're in the game right do and you're trying to get into your 146 negative betting progression do you originally bet the table minimum until that opportunity presents itself or do you play if you're playing quarters do you play quarters right straight through and then that first bet in the progression is a quarter? Okay.

SPEAKER_05 31:48

So the question is should we test the water? That's really the question all right I test the water when I play. If I'm playing the one four six I don't walk into the casino sit down at a table and start with one four six I'll usually start with one two three if I'm really unsure of the game or if I've had the opportunity to do some good table selection I've and I've selected what I think is a good game I'll probably start with one three four okay just to make sure this is a good game. If it's not a good game if I've made an error I would rather lose at one two three or one three four than a one four six it's just testing the water. Now that's what John Taermino is saying in his tape and the playing the first base system he's skipping all of that and he's going right to high bets.

SPEAKER_02 32:42

No low bets no progressions no anything he was asking do you do you start at the table minimum before you go up and go on again okay okay I think he was asking do you start at the table minimum and see if it's going good before you up your bet is was that the question is it isn't that what I'm answering? No maybe I'm lost here. You're going over the 146. He's saying do you start at the lowest then if it's going right then go with the bigger money one four six.

SPEAKER_05 33:06

Let me start this over again this may or may not be the table minimum if I'm playing a quarter table and I'm betting one quarter, a hundred dollars $150, it is the table minimum okay when I test the water I walk into a table and I don't know anything about that table I'll usually play at the table minimum for a couple of hands three or four hands that's all before I'll go into my progression. Then I'll I may do that but once I once I go into the progression that's it the only reason I'm doing that is to find out am I going to stay at this table or not?

SPEAKER_03 33:47

Yes we're gonna end off this side of uh the table and move forward to the end in preparation for playing side two